Note overlapping rest

[YumeChan]

Hello everyone! I'm pretty fresh to Utau and just starting off with everything.
I'm having this problem, that when there is a rest in a UST, the note coming after that sometimes starts way too early, making it sound completely out of rythm. I've tried meddling with the envelope option and while it does make the note start when it's supposed to, it's also cutting off the start of the note, turning for example a "da" into an "a".
Here is a screenshot of what I mean, you see where the note is supposed to start and I've marked red where the note actually does start for me.

I've been searching all over the place for a solution for this, but couldn't really find anything helpful.
To be honest, I'm not even sure how to properly word it on google...
I don't believe it's a problem with the UST, since I've tried about 20 different USTs from the web and all of them had this little problem in some place. Resetting the envelopes and using the "p2 p3" button don't seem to work either, since it somehow goes back to the exact same place it was.
Maybe it's just normal and I'm stupid, but it just sounds very wrong to me when using it.
For information, I'm using Utau on Windows 8 Pc.

Thank you already for the help and please excuse my "noobness"!

Have a nice day!~

 

[dezzydream]

have you tried selecting the whole ust, going into property, and clearing preutterance and overlap?

 

[YumeChan]

Yup. It's all clear there, unfortunately.

 

[Aeroza]

I'm sure this is pretty common for a CV voicebank since these voicebanks doesn't usually have a starting note like "- ka" and "- ki" in VCV. My solution for this problem is to go to the voicebank settings and duplicating every note and adding "-" as the prefix. Then, slightly bring the preutterance to the left for each of the note. Then, for each note after a rest, simply put "-" like "- ka" and "- ki". I'm really sorry if this sounds really confusing but this works fine with me.

 

[partial]

This is common for CV voicebanks.
On notes that start early for you, can you select one of them and hit CRTL and G? If you share screencaps of the oto config for each of the notes that give you trouble, we can better tell you how to fix i.

 

[YumeChan]

I'm sure this is pretty common for a CV voicebank since these voicebanks doesn't usually have a starting note like "- ka" and "- ki" in VCV. My solution for this problem is to go to the voicebank settings and duplicating every note and adding "-" as the prefix. Then, slightly bring the preutterance to the left for each of the note. Then, for each note after a rest, simply put "-" like "- ka" and "- ki". I'm really sorry if this sounds really confusing but this works fine with me.

Hmm I think I understand what you mean. Thank you for the advice! I'm going to try that!

This is common for CV voicebanks.
On notes that start early for you, can you select one of them and hit CRTL and G? If you share screencaps of the oto config for each of the notes that give you trouble, we can better tell you how to fix i.

Here is one of the troubling notes:

And here is the config for it:

I hope this is right. It's good to know that this is a common cv problem though, thank you for the info!

 

[HoodyP2]

Hmm I think I understand what you mean. Thank you for the advice! I'm going to try that!



Here is one of the troubling notes:

And here is the config for it:

I hope this is right. It's good to know that this is a common cv problem though, thank you for the info!

I think I see the problem... I think it’s because in the config, you have the overlap (the green bar/line) behind the preutterance (the red bar/line). This can actually work well for vowel notes (sometimes) but it can cause an overlapping/timing issue when it comes trying to play a CV note... I recommend putting the overlap (green) on the middle of when the consonant is said and the preutterance (red) onto where the vowel starts... I don’t have a pic right now bc I’m using a phone but I think you can get an idea... I hope my tip helps!

 

[수연 <Suyeon>]

On phone as well, but tried to edit the pic according to what @HoodyP2 said so you can have an illustration. Since there's not much silent space to work with, i wouldn't have the beginning of the file cut off (first blue)

 

[HoodyP2]

Okay I'm back with using my laptop with some more detailed images... As shown in the images of the config from my voicebank (VCV also contains CV notes so its no different), you can see that the overlap (green) is placed around the middle of the consonant wave, while the preutterance (red) is around the end of the consonant and the start of the vowel (like Suyeon mentioned)... additional things to make it better is to longify the offset (the pink bar) to have the consonant part in it so you can place the overlap... OPTIONALLY, if you are using a type of resampler that loops the note (just like what I'm using, moresampler. The default resampler actually slows down the note.), I suggest covering the 1/3 back end of the note with the cutoff (the blue bar) and shortening the middle, so that it will have a smooth sound! (Here I've shown with two examples, one is with a long consonant like ch, sh, h, s, m, z, etc. while the other is the one with a short consonant like b, d, k, g, etc.):


ps... I think that weird "cut-off" that happened when you tried to edit the envelope is actually just you switching from Mode 2 to Mode 1, it doesn't really affect anything other than hiding the pitch bends and the overlaping start of the notes... You can just trigger this back and forth by pressing "X"...

 

[YumeChan]

Okay I'm back with using my laptop with some more detailed images... As shown in the images of the config from my voicebank (VCV also contains CV notes so its no different), you can see that the overlap (green) is placed around the middle of the consonant wave, while the preutterance (red) is around the end of the consonant and the start of the vowel (like Suyeon mentioned)... additional things to make it better is to longify the offset (the pink bar) to have the consonant part in it so you can place the overlap... OPTIONALLY, if you are using a type of resampler that loops the note (just like what I'm using, moresampler. The default resampler actually slows down the note.), I suggest covering the 1/3 back end of the note with the cutoff (the blue bar) and shortening the middle, so that it will have a smooth sound! (Here I've shown with two examples, one is with a long consonant like ch, sh, h, s, m, z, etc. while the other is the one with a short consonant like b, d, k, g, etc.):View attachment 8638View attachment 8639


ps... I think that weird "cut-off" that happened when you tried to edit the envelope is actually just you switching from Mode 2 to Mode 1, it doesn't really affect anything other than hiding the pitch bends and the overlaping start of the notes... You can just trigger this back and forth by pressing "X"...

First off, thank you for going through all the trouble to explain that to me, I learned a lot from that! And your advice actually worked! It's a lot better now and the note also doesn't cut-off anymore.
Thank you to everyone else who helped as well!

 

[Cola-notPro]

2023. New UTAU user here who came across the same problem. Thank you, Hoody for the explanation. It worked for me and helped me to understand too better.